Any Regrets?
February 3, 2008
(Regrets? Get it? We do crack ourself up.)
No pre-snarking, as we are really posting this before it aired so we haven’t seen it yet…so what’s the verdict, Gentle Readers?
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WELL! *sniffles a bit*
Far from perfect, but a darn sight better than that abomination from last summer. Olivia Williams was quite wonderful. I need to see it again before I decide if I like it. I definitely don’t hate it.
I will sniffle along with you, Mags.
Good or bad, it was a hundred times better than the other shlock we’ve been fed thus far.
I missed the last 15 minutes due to a phone call. I will have to wait until Friday to see the end. Maybe someone will bittorrent it sooner… I don’t recall Mrs. Austen being as negative about Jane’s writing. Am I confused? But Olivia Williams did a great job, I thought.
Eh buh whah? I don’ geddit. It seemed rather incoherant (maybe that’s the nature of biopic, but there was no real, well, anything). And Jane was more than a little tipsy, more than I’d expect at 40.
But Olivia Williams is brilliant.
No Regrets…I thought it was the best of the JA season so far.
I too had sniffles through a lot of it. but I must say I enjoyed it for its over tone but I to hold off my final judgment until I can see it again to think and understand it better. I loved how they put quotes in the script and I thought it was done much better than other movies have tried to do the same thing. I thought you needed some background on her life and family to understand it and that the character development for the secondary characters was a bit lacking but other than that it made me cry, it made me laugh and it made me smile. Olivia Williams was the best Jane Austen I could have imagined and so it was much better that that becoming Jane “thing” that was released last year.
Well, I wanted to KILL Fanny Knight on several occaisons, they presented her as a rude, heartless baggage, but other than that, I loved it (um, more or less. I don’t think she was *that* flirty,at that age, IMO). Totally sniffled through the letter burning scene.
I think this one did a wonderful job of capturing the tone and humor of Jane Austen. That ability to step back and laugh at a situation, even at her own foolishness, is just what I imagine her to have been. Her female relatives seemed a bit sharp, however. I was feeling a bit of something at my pen’s end whenever Fanny got peevish.
I wish there had been more Anna. I think she is my favorite of Jane’s relatives. How about a movie about her advice to Anna on her novel-writing? I suppose regrets of lost love is more poignant.
I saw Fanny as being one of Jane Austen’s heroines, sort of like Marianne Dashwood–she had to grow up and understand love and romance and how they relate to real life.
I liked how Jane was sharp and clever and a little snarky and was pleased that they showed her ultimately comfortable with her life decisions. Most of her “regrets” seemed to be related to the family finances–and there was even more going on than they showed, there was Edward’s lawsuit, Henry’s bankruptcy, and an expected inheritance from Uncle Leigh Perrot that didn’t happen. It is likely that these things contributed to her fatal illness, or exacerbated it, if she did indeed have Addison’s disease–stress and sudden shock will exacerbate it.
I didn’t like Mrs. Austen reaming her out about turning down Harris Bigg-Wither, but I do understand what they are trying to do–she was the devil’s advocate, she was that part of Jane’s conscience and Cassandra was the other. I liked Jane being funny and having fun–that was what I missed the most in Becoming Jane–but not so much the crawling around in the shrubberies three sheets to the wind. I think she had a little more dignity than that! And where was Martha Lloyd? And why was Mme. Bigeon eating at the table like she’s not a servant?
I have other quibbles, but they are mostly sartorial. I said aloud a few too many times, “What the Ferrars does she have on her head?” Seriously, what was that thing she was wearing at Carlton House? Wouldn’t it have been cool if they had dressed her to look like the drawing in James Stanier Clarke’s Friendship Book? (And James Stanier Clarke was perfection in the film!) I expected to see her in, er, higher necklines, and a spinster’s cap. Not so much the lace do-rag.
I liked Mr. Haden a LOT. PHWOAR. But I’m not so sure I appreciated Jane the Cougar a whole lot. I think the whole episode was Jane writing teasingly about Fanny’s crush on Mr. Haden than one of her own.
I’ll cop to crying at the end, not when Cassandra was burning the letters but when they showed the previews for Pride and Prejudice. Oh I so wish she hadn’t died so young — so much doubtless great work died with her.
I’m going to stay up and pull an all nighter and watch it again. lol
The production and cinematography was far better than everything else as far as the Jane Austen Season goes. This film definitely reached in and touched my heart.
I am a bit torn. Olivia stole the screen. No doubt about that, however, was Miss Austen THAT negative? They are merely speculating her personality correct? I am no authority or scholar on Miss Austen. Just a mere reader.
I must say that, it has been the first film about Jane’s life where I felt that complete sense of love and closeness which Jane and Cassandra shared. The letter burning scene was portrayed beautifully.
Olivia Williams is always a delight on screen, and this was no exception to that rule. Will definitely be seeing this one again. Good thing I have it on my DVR.
I watched the Super Bowl.
I don’t know, but I felt it was kind of a downer; it actually left me a little depressed at the end. I did love Olivia Williams, and I agree that if you don’t know something about Jane, you are hard-pressed to follow the story. I didn’t like the tipsy Jane, and though I know the mother was “difficult” to say the least, her harangue was a bit over the top. And was Fanny Knight really such a little pill? I found her positively cruel last night
One thing I did appreciate, is that unlike the adaptations thus far, we got to “hear” words that Jane actually wrote for a change.
That “thing” with Anne Hathaway last year was such drivel, that I think it has left me permanently wary of Jane bio-pics. I guess that I don’t really want to see anyone pretending to be Jane Austen on the screen because no one could possibly do her justice.
What I found interesting about it was that it took a small amount of material (the facts of Jane’s life, many of which are lost) and expanded on it, in contrast to the other adaptations, which try to cram long and detailed books into 90 minutes, like a camel through the eye of a needle. Gillian Anderson stated this before it began, something like, “We must imagine it,” which I thought was a nice preface–admitting to its being something of a “made-up story.” It felt thin, while the others felt overfull. I thought that the artsy shots of the household items and the scenery were overused, as was the shaky camera technique. No need for that. But Olivia Williams was a delight, and I really enjoyed how complicated she and this film made her. Jane was not crammed into the pigeonhole of Elizabeth, Fanny, Mary Crawford, or any of her other characters. She was a complex woman in and of herself.
Mags, I agree with you on the sartorial issues. Where did they come up with that cap and wouldn’t it have been lovely to see her in something stylish when she goes to see the Prince Regent’s librarian?
My favorite passage was the conversation with Mme. Bigeon about how she and her friends are made to feel about the romantic passions in their lives. It seemed that conversation foretold ‘Persuasion.’ Loved it.
And, it seemed one of those films that needed some of that explanatory narrative at the end. Like, she wasn’t widely popular in her time, that Edward’s lawsuit was successful, that the naval brothers rose in the ranks and made contributions to their mother’s and sister’s comfort.
But, I thought, shedding a few tears, that it portrayed her liveliness and her fears as a single woman as well as anything I’ve seen.
I was a bit disappointed. I thought the actress playing Jane was good, but I really feel they gave Jane many more boyfriends in the film than she had in life. And I had a hard time beliving that Mrs. Austen and Fanny would be so cruel in real life. In my humble opinion, Jane was much more content in real life than they made out in the movie. However, it did interest me enough to keep switching off the superbowl, and to learn more about Jane. Anyone recommend a good book about her life?
I was a bit hesitant going into this, but I ended up loving it and teared up throughout it. The nicely done drops of quotes(agree with everyone else about how it did mounds better than other attempts)
And Olivia Williams was brilliant as Jane!
Fanny Knight was a bit tiring after a while, but I could see how they were showing the contrast with where she was in life compared to Jane and how Fanny needed to grow up.
Also loved all the moments with Brook Bridges and Jane’s siblings. I nearly yelled at the screen when Cassandra burned the letters(even though I already knew it was going to happen/that it happened, but it still hit me)
I especially loved all the moments with Jane writing, the one where she stops when the maid came in and started right back up the second she left was one of my favorite moments. She was sarcastic and spunky and yet still wounded by everything that’s happened to her.
“The only way to get a man like Mr. Darcy is to make him up.”
Best. Line. Ever.
I even teared at the previews for next week.
Also, the waltzing and everyone knowing that she was an author. Hmmm?
Still thinking about it, but I agree with those who found it depressing and negative. Despite some good moments, the overall impression of Jane was that she was bitter, unpleasant, and unlikeable. (That is what my husband thought, as an unbiased viewer who knows little of JA.) Very few of the other characters were sympathetic or even had any understandable motivations unless you already had a pretty good knowledge of JA’s family. I found the shrubbery scene and the scenes with Mr. Haden embarrassing. While I’m not saying that JA didn’t struggle and have dark moments in reality, the movie amplified this to the point that it was hard to believe in her words of content at the end. Too melodramatic. I couldn’t help thinking that JA herself would have enjoyed mocking several scenes.
PS–My favorite scene was Jane reading bits from Persuasion to Cassandra. That is exactly how I imagined them both.
Mary: Try “Jane Austen: A Life”, by Claire Tomalin
Re last night’s production, I have mixed feelings about this. Agree with others that it was far superior to anything else we’ve been offered recently and Olivia Williams was excellent. She had the sharp mind and wit that I would expect 40-year old Jane to have. But gosh, she really pounded the alcohol, didn’t she? That was a little un-necessary; there was something Sex and The Cityish about giving her such a modern twist. It made her appear desperate and full of regrets, needing to drown them in alcohol instead of independent and worried mostly about finances with perhaps only the occasional regret. Also, the Cassandra character was written almost like an obssessive lesbian crush instead of a devoted sister. Granted, Cassandra was a pretty morbid personality, but I thought she was overdone. Apart from those misgivings, it was well-done, in period, and stayed pretty faithful to actual events (with a few liberties taken) so it remains the best they’ve offered so far.
PaddyDog: glad I’m not the only one uncomfortable with the portrayal of Cassandra. There was nothing sisterly–their relationship seemed creepy and one-sided instead.
I enjoyed it immensely! It was much better than I ever thought it could be. Close to her life’s story and showing a Jane much as I imagine her. Olivia Williams is brilliant as always and I enjoyed Fanny and Cassandra’s characters very much.
James Stanier Clarke was so funny! I really enjoyed how they not only included quotes from JA’s novels and letters but also from her concept for a novel.
I really liked how they portrayed Miss Austen’s relationship with her brothers and family over all. She was a little bit more flirtatious than I thought she really ought to have been and drank a bit too much wine for a parson’s daughter. But altogether I really loved this film and can’t wait to watch it again!
Katharine T: Thank You! Cassandra really made my skin crawl at times. I had the distinct impression that if Jane had tried to marry someone and leave the house, Cassandra would have gone on a killing rampage.
I really enjoyed it. Olivia Williams did a great job as Jane. I did wonder, having not yet read Jane Austen’s letters, how much the crush on the doctor was in real life.
I also cursed my local PBS station for running a 2-minute long flash flood warning for the island of Kauai that obliterated all sound during the scene where Jane and Fanny are in their London bedroom during the daytime, right before Jane’s visit with the Prince Regent’s librarian. Could anybody recap that for me? Did they talk about the “widower with six children” that I somehow missed the background on?
Oh, I almost forgot my number one beef with last night: in the dancing scene in Edward’s house, they are dancing to a slip jig which is fine, except in addition to the violin, the most predominant instrument is a guitar. A guitar! And when the camera flashes on the violinist, he is slowly moving the bow up and down as opposed to the vigorous movements he would need to play a slip jig. It would take no time at all to track down or record a slip jig played with instruments available at the time. I really hate when they take stupid shortcuts like that.
I need to watch it again before I’m able to form any real opinion of it, since I missed several bits & pieces due to my compulsive channel-switching between Jane and the Superbowl – including a large chunk toward the end which I missed, when I became thoroughly distracted by the game, which had become a rather thrilling nail-biter!
From what I saw, however, I quite adored it. I had a few nitpicks, of course, most of which have already been mentioned by others: the weird doo-rag Jane wore; the tipsy stumbling through shrubbery, etc. I found Fanny very annoying; even in her sweeter moments, she set my teeth on edge.
On the other hand, I thought Olivia Williams was wonderful, and I thoroughly enjoyed Jane’s snark. I look forward to watching it again.
Oh!!! I wish it were April already so I could see it right now. By all you have said (including those who have found it depressing) I think I will love it.
I was disappointed in Jane’s hat, it looked like a recycled tea cozy.
I can see how Fanny’s supposed to be a Marianne type figure, but I think they went overboard with the crass immaturity! She may have been silly and stupid like most teenagers, but I don’t think she would have been insulting.
And I’m surprised people found Cassandra and Jane’s relationship creepy. As a queer reader I am used to finding lesbian subtext everywhere, but I totally didn’t get that from the movie. I think it’s just very unusual to see the depiction of a sibling relationship as the primary one in a person’s life.
Loved it, loved it, loved it. And a half.
Would Jane Austen be one who would regret? Just a thought (out of many) after watching the movie.
I was quite happy with it. Olivia Williams was a very believable Jane & showed her delightful wit & sarcasm. The scenes with the boozing, & petulant rebuttals to Hayden, would have curled some gentle reader’s lace (including mine), but who knows, she may have had that very streak in her.
I thought she portrayed very well how difficult it was to be a woman living in that age, expected to be dependant on males for security, but yet wanting to be independant with her gift and maintaining her high ground of marrying for love. And, yes, I believe she may have been lonely at times, even though she was happy with her choice(s). Compound all that with her brothers being in dire financial straits, that would have rightly tormented her that she wasn’t able to help them.
I used to lament that Cassandra had burned Jane’s letters, leaving the rest of us with so little of her. But after watching the movie, it struck me that these communications between them were private & should rightly be cherished between the two only.(I offer no commentary whatsoever about the lesbian angle since I don’t believe any of it)
Andygrrl: Just to clarify, I have no problems with lesbians or lesbian subtext so I wasn’t equating lesbian with creepy. But as someone who does have a very close relationship with a sister, I just found the whole thing a little off. Cassandra barely broke a smile for the entire hour and half. She tacitly admitted toward the end that she encouraged Jane to break her engagement out of self interest so that she wouldn’t be alone. We know she burned most of Jane’s letters, but she hardly did it ceremonially in a folly on the night of her niece’s wedding. It seemed that they decided her affection for her dead fiance was completely transferred to Jane and had become obssessional. That was the creepy part.
I agree with the comment that it was slight, with many of the points being repeated without fresh purpose. And the modern ideas of “freedom” as opposed to the bondage of marriage were not exactly well illustrated by the constant references to Janes dependence and the stress and deprivation of her impoverished state. (And did I get this wrong or was the film trying to suggest that Henry was complicit in Jane not getting more money from her publisher because he wanted to avoid the embarrassment of having a sister who worked for a living?)
But I quite liked the obvious smackdown to Becoming Jane when this Miss Austen summed up the overblown Tom Lefroy tragedy with “I was unhappy for five minutes.” Ha!
PaddyDog: Don’t worry, I can see why Cassandra would come off as creepy; I think she tends to get a raw deal, since she’s mostly known as The Destroyer of Jane’s Letters. I saw her as a bit depressed, and maybe morbidly grieving, more pathetic than creepy. I thought her fixation on Jane had less to do with Jane herself than with her fear of loneliness (and with that Mrs. Austen for a mother, I don’t blame her!)
Now, if you wanna talk wildly inappropriate lesbian subtext, Rozema’s “Mansfield Park” could keep me here all day…::rolls eyes::
I enjoyed the piece and was also saddened by what might have been…was anyone else struck by the echos (not the lesbian subtext) of virginia woolf’s comments that “a woman in order to write needs a room of one’s own?” Jane’s references to the fact that she couldn’t write if she had married, and in spite of the disadvantages, in the end was happy with her choices because it allowed her to write? oh to have the diary at least….
Very enjoyable — we’ve all definitely seen worse. Off the JA subject: Masterpiece, Masterpiece Theatre, or Masterpiece Classics, whoever they are now, couldn’t they afford a library, or some setting, for their new spokesperson? I’m starting to think of her as Gillian Headroom!
Speaking of subtexts, what about:
“If the vicar’s daughter starts off on water, she’s sure to end up on gin”.
And yes, Andygrrl: I was somewhat struck by the harpishness of Mrs. Austen. My mother frequently calls to tell me about how well ex-boyfriends are doing and what kind of house I could be living in if I had married one of them, so perhaps now that you’ve brought it up, I have great sympathy with Cassandra.
I’m quite mystified by the people who found it negative. I thought it envisioned Jane as maintaining her sense of fun and liveliness throughout her life, and really appreciating the freedom she had as a result of the choices she’d made, although she did seem (and I think the real Jane felt this way also) unhappy that she was not able to better provide for her family.
I do agree with the people who thought Cassandra was creepy, however … sort of a non-person, she seemed so dour and sad. And what about the sitting-room scene with Cassandra weeping about “persuading” Jane to change her mind about accepting H.B-W.? Was that a suggestion that perhaps Cassandra wanted H. B-W. for herself? I don’t recall anything in any of the biographic literature I’ve read (and I’ve read a lot of it, although it’s always possible that I’ve missed a few, lol) that speculated this was the case. Did I miss something?
Hmm. After two viewings I’m not seeing Cassandra portrayed as some creepy sister who has a lesbian crush lol. Selfish perhaps. I tend to think she burned the letters out of loyalty to her sister’s privacy. Had she kept them all, who knows what we would know now, and maybe I like the fact that I know very little.
LOL Gillian Headroom.
I didn’t get anything negative from Cassandra’s behavior, either. I thought she tried to talk Jane out of marrying HB-W because she knew that Jane didn’t love him, that Jane was accepting him for not only her own security but her mother’s and sister’s, and didn’t want Jane to make that sacrifice on her behalf.
Before watching this movie, I thought Cassandra was just supportive of Jane’s decision not to marry HBW, not that she influenced her. From the movie, I got that Cassandra actively talked Jane out of it in order to keep Jane for herself.
I didn’t find Fanny all that annoying, but being about the same age as her character is probably why her behavior didn’t bother me (we 19/20 year olds are notoriously snotty to our elders, lol). I quite enjoyed it overall, despite the insertion of Tipsy!Jane into many scenes. It was certainly more watchable than Becoming
SallyJane which was about as Austen-ish as my left big toe.Re Cassandra’s motives in talking Jane out of marriage, the implication (I’m sure it was fabricated) in the film last night was that she did it selfishly because she didn’t want to be left a spinster alone. In the scene where she is bathing Jane in the bedroom and Jane is angry that she is going to die without providing for her mother and Cass, they had a conversation where Cass admits she talked her out of it out of self-interest not out of any regard for Jane’s feelings.
And, I agree she burned the letters out of a sense of privacy, but I doubt (as I posted above) that she burned them ceremonially on the night of Fanny’s wedding while everyone else was making merry inside. It was that kind of unnecessary melodramatic attention-drawing behaviour that made her appear creepy (in the film). I’m pretty sure she was quite level-headed in real life (with the exception of deciding on spinsterhood at an early age in reaction to her finace’s death, which by anyone’s standards is more than a little self-depriving).
I think this movie was mis-titled: I didn’t see this portrayal of Jane Austen as someone plagued by regrets. I saw her as someone who was plagued by financial dependence and insecurity. She herself says near the end that she is much happier than she thought she would be, that she owes everything she has accomplished to Cassandra (i.e., her books, which she would not have been able to write if she were pregnant every year or so and raising babies and being mistress of a great estate or a parsonage), and that her only regret is not earning more money that she could leave to Cassandra and her mother.
Strangely, some of the comments here make me think I was watching a different film: I did not see the character’s drinking as excessive or her behavior as inappropriately flirtatious. SHE attributes her shaking hand to too much drinking, but we know it is an early symptom of her illness. I love the fact that this is a film that breaks out of the “dear Aunt Jane” misconception of my most beloved author.
As for the believability of her mother’s accusations and longstanding grudges, and of Fanny Knight’s mean-spirited comments: Anyone who comes from even a mildly dysfunctional family (and who does not) knows that those who are closest know how to say the most hurtful things. I cannot imagine that families in Austen’s day didn’t have the same propensity for acting in hurtful ways and then instantly regretting the words. In Fanny’s case, she was a classic teenager, self-centered and apt to throw her idol off the pedestal as soon as she discerned a flaw. Fanny was 20 when acting out, but close enough to a teenager to make her behavior believable and all too human. At least for this viewer.
As for the probable fabrication that Cassandra persuaded Jane to renege on the acceptance of Harris Bigg-Wither partly for selfish motives: For this viewer it simply gave this otherwise saintly character a human flaw that made me feel more for her than I had before that very affecting scene. Made up, I’ve no doubt, but excellent screenwriting.
I thought Olivia Williams was brilliant.
There are always nits to be picked, and no movie will ever be historically accurate, no matter how many times we moan and cry and throw history books at people from our high horses. After all, even the best historians don’t know the whole truth. We’re all in it for entertainment in the end, admit it.
What I’m mostly concerned about is the overall quality of the film. For a clearly niche film with a specific audience in mind, it was quite satisfactory. Gillian Anderson even had the speech at the beginning about guessing, which was humble enough to mollify some of the armchair historians.
I liked it, even with annoying teenager, booze, and recluse sister. I like to think of Austen occasionally waking up with hangover headaches. I giggled. Unlike during Becoming Jane, when I threw the remote, gagged, and then shut it off. In that order.
Now, when is Northanger Abbey II: Catherine, Vampyre Slayer coming out? I don’t want to miss it.
I loved the film and sniffed through most of it. Olivia W was just wonderful as was Greta S.
So little is known about Austen’s life and somehow they made sense of their research. I loved the ending because I have always wondered what motivated Cassandra to burn Jane’s journals and most letters. Basically, they didn’t answer that question and I was thrilled. We should be left wondering somehow.
Northanger Abbey II: Catherine, Vampyre Slayer
LOL!
I really enjoyed it. Jane was depicted as a complex, three-dimensional person that was more than just quotes from her writing (although that lovely lovely writing was in there and I enjoyed every word of it as I always do).
I think Jane is an enigma and everyone wants to try their crack at the puzzle. How can a woman, who has never known true love and never been married, write so trenchantly about the subject?
I think she was human, as were the other members of her family. And that’s how she was shown.
The part that gripped me the most and found me tearing up and sniffling? The part where she is sitting with her sister at the picnic and she tells her “I have so many characters and so many stories in my head and so little time…” Oh how I would have loved to have read them.
Anna – so glad I’m not alone! We got a flash flood warning here on Maui, and I literally started screaming at the tv screen! Could not believe that it went on for soooo long – it really felt longer than two minutes!! I keep telling my sister that they could have just scrolled it across the screen – I was also wondering what the conversation was?
As to Cassandra’s and Jane relationship…I didn’t think anything was weird about it. But, my sister and I are extremely close, and a lot of our friends don’t understand that we “like” hanging out with each other. Whereas, I think people who barely talk to their siblings(especially siblings of the same sex)and have no idea what is going on with there life are strange…and I find it a bit sad.
Question for the forum: I have often heard it said and it’s been noted here also that Jane Austen knew so much about true love despite having lived as a spinster. Would anyone agree that while she certainly wrote very compellingly about true attraction and the forming of attachments, (since no more than a couple of lines is ever dedicated in her books to the long haul i.e, the marriage once one is 5-10 years in), she actually never really wrote about true, lasting love? Yes, she writes of other secondary and tertiary characters who are long married and supposedly happy, but none of the protagonist couples is ever portrayed beyond the point of agreeing to marry. I think she was a master at creating partnerships that would be likely to end up in marriage given how courting took place at the time, but I’ve never been convinced that all of those pairings would be happy together forever. For instance, while I’ve always thought Elizabeth and Darcy had a good chance of keeping the spark for the long haul, I have equally always thought that Marianne Dashwood would become terribly bored with Edward Ferrars over time. Anyway, just throwing that out there. It’s not a criticism of her work which I have adored for over 30 years. It’s just a distinction between writing well about falling in love versus staying in love.
I enjoyed it. I loved Olivia Williams in the Beckinsale Emma, Peter Pan, and Rushmore. I love that face of hers, not just in a girl-crush way, but she’s so lovely and expressive. Speaking of girl-crush, though, I don’t think there was anything creepy about Jane and Cassandra. there was just the creepiness of growing old with your own sister, having that over-closeness of being always together: finishing sentences, knowing how to push buttons, codependency. I’ve seen some of that in my husband’s family, and it’s unfortunate but only as creepy as is the situation.
And wasn’t Greta Scacchi Mrs. Weston in the Paltrow Emma?
I am ashamed. I was watching the Super Bowl, and I missed it.
Do you know of any of those way cool bootleg sites to watch it on?
I’m sure someone will post the stray satellite signal reception location eventually… *cough*
From Comment 52: “I have equally always thought that Marianne Dashwood would become terribly bored with Edward Ferrars over time.”
Marianne pretty much said that herself early in the novel. Good thing she married Colonel Brandon, while her sister married Edward Ferrars.
I regret watching “Miss Austen Regrets.” Jane was bitter, Fanny annoying and Cassandra quite bland. If that accurately portrayed the end of Jane’s life, I’d rather be ignorant and stick to her fictional creations.
To SeaSpot — apparently it’ll be in the same box as the new S&S when that comes out.
Shout out to Julie P. and SeaSpot!!! Haven’t seen y’all around in a coon’s age. Fond memories of the old Sam W. “B” index. Regretfully, I also missed seeing this new JA broadcast, so will be watching for random satellite links *cough*.
Kira: Oops! Note to self: do not comment after a terribly long day on e-mail when ones brain is no longer functioning. Thanks for catching the error. I meant Elinor but I’m too tired this morning to re-post the whole question so I’ll just let it go.
PaddyDog–I actually wasn’t sure if you meant Elinor, or if you thought Marianne would tire of Colonel Brandon. It did make me smile, though, thinking of Marianne’s “there is a something wanting” speech about Edward!
I thought the film was a well done and interesting depiction of Jane’s life. There were some things I did not agree with. For example, it seemed a little jarring to hear her discuss characters from her books in social situations. Somehow I imagined that she would be more private about her work, feeling like she was calling too much attention to herself to discuss it at length socially. But, that is just my guess.
I applaud the attempt to show her as a real woman in early middle age. The scene where she is reacting to the Doctor turning his attention to Fanny’s youthful charms, and away from her complex, mature beauty, was very touching. Also, dealing with an unreasonable, demanding mother is an experience that many women in their 40s and 50s share today. Perhaps she would have written about long lasting love and marriage if she lived longer?
To Deb R. — how did you like the description of the “real” Captain Wentworth’s visit to Brooklyn yesterday? I am still very sad I could not sneak out of work to get there.
Julie P – I am all despair!!!!! I just dashed back over to that post, hopeful that someone had reported on the event, but alas, still nothing. I bet our old friend Helen on the Left Coast is also tearing her hair out over missing this. I agree, (most of) the oldies are still the goodies.
Miss Austen regrets she’s unable to write today…
I liked this much more than I thought I would! I’m too exhausted from posting about Ciaran Hinds over at Pemberley to give much detail but even if I weren’t I wouldn’t want to say too much. Even though we all share a love of Jane, we all have our own personal relationship with her, and to talk too much about this almost feels like spilling the secrets of a friend.
I will only add that I cried at her being fawned over almost as much as I did when she suffered.
#52
I agree with you, PaddyDog. Jane Austen is supposed to have written love stories, but that was never my impression.
There is talk of ‘love’ but not dealt with in great detail in her novels, because that was never the main theme.
NA – a parody of a *certain* kind of gothic novels.
S&S – she’s actually drawing in words the quality of these two characteristics, it’s effects etc.
P&P – the high and lows of society
MP – The different moral standards
Emma – she tries her hand at mystery, plus drawing a pretty picture of provincial life in Highbury
Persuasion – this is one novel with love as quite central. We see it immortalized in the letter. But there is also a quality about it which seems to draw a picture of ‘women’s situation at home, with so many women characters in different situations. Persuasion has the most number of women.
And of course *all* novels deal with the teething problems of growing up, the situation of women in society etc.
How she came to be called a writer of love stories, I can’t imagine.
PS: my comment about there being the most number of women in Persuasion, actually meant ‘the most number of women in ‘significant’ roles.
Mrs Smith, Mrs Clay, Lady Russell (the most important, I would say
the two Musgrove sisiters. And of course the three Eliot sisters.
Didn’t read all the comments..so I may be duplicating. Olivia Williams was great. She, of course, made the quintessential Jane Fairfax in “Emma” and I thought she was fabulous here too.
I know there are big holes in Jane Austen’s story…but I didn’t like a lot of the dramatic license taken with what we do know.
Miss Austen did appear to make a rich and rewarding life, despite her circumstances. I guess I didn’t like that THAT wasn’t celebrated more, instead of the constant litany of regrets and missed chances.
But…taken for what it is…it was well paced, beautifully costumed and I agree with those who said what a pleasure it was to hear some of Jane’s written words spoken by this Jane.
Since I have not seen MAR yet, I have been looking up the JA’s letters where Dr. Haden appears mentioned and in one, she wrote:
He is no apothecary… He is a Haden, nothing but a Haden…”
Also one of the entries in Fanny Knight’s diaries, as quoted by the JA Family Record, Fanny wrote:
“Mr. Haden, a delightful clever musical “Haden” comes every evening…”
As English is not my first language, I suspect I am missing a joke since both aunt and niece refer to him as a “Haden”, I would think the word might not only be a family name but also a noun of which I do not know its meaning, I have looked up at some of the dictionaries I have but it does not show. Is there an English word “haden” and what does it mean, please?
Cinthia, I do not know of a word “Haden” either. I can only think that Fanny is making a joke about him being like Hayden the composer – maybe?
I agree, Mags!
I was thinking, Jane never expected to make any money on her writing, right? I mean, she was thrilled that she did, and wanted to make more (and there are some laughing allusions in her letters to that), but she never had any intention of supporting her family, and no one expected that of her.
Jen K,
>I’m too exhausted from posting about Ciaran Hinds over at Pemberley <
And where at Pemberley would this be?
“there was just the creepiness of growing old with your own sister, having that over-closeness of being always together: finishing sentences, knowing how to push buttons, codependency. I’ve seen some of that in my husband’s family, and it’s unfortunate but only as creepy as is the situation.”
That made me sad…and a bit scared! Sister and I live together, and neither of us are married…although at 27, I wouldn’t want to be married yet. But, is closeness with a sister weird with most people? I guess it could be if, as Debra mentioned above, it became an over closeness that closed out other people, or made one too dependent on the other.
Cinthia, there is no word “Haden,” Jane was just being silly and lighthearted. I think that might be where the idea that she had a crush on Mr. Haden came from. I am of the opinion that she was being silly because she liked him for Fanny’s sake (though perhaps she liked him herself, a little bit).
Lori, I personally would like to see a movie with Jane being a shrewd businesswoman–because I think she was (and they did show that in passing in MAR–she talked about switching publishers, etc.). And I think she always WANTED to make some money from her writing but was thwarted on her first couple of attempts–when her father tried to sell First Impressions and then the Susan mess with Crosby & Son. But still, she had a pretty sweet deal at Chawton–her brothers supported her financially and her mother and Cassandra and Martha Lloyd did the housework so she was free to write. But I’m sure she would have preferred to have money of her own, and especially felt it when the family was going through their financial crisis as shown in the movie.
LynnS, the post (and its many responses!) is on the Meetings board. There is also a pointer from the Persuasion board. As, you know, that is the movie we were all there to watch and discuss
Mags, I thought about linking, or copying and pasting, or whatever, over here, but just couldn’t imagine where or if or when. ?
You could send me an e-mail.
I haven’t seen it yet, but can’t wait to! Actually, the thought of Jane getting a bit tipsy now and then makes me grin. She certainly had no aversion to wine – there are various references in her letters to drinking it.
Someone above wrote, “SHE attributes her shaking hand to too much drinking, but we know it is an early symptom of her illness.” I beg to differ. She wrote that letter in 1800 when she was 24 years old. A full 15 years before the onset of her fatal illness.
Elaina and Mags, thank you both very much about “Haden”, I was afraid that I might be missing a joke.
I think that might be where the idea that she had a crush on Mr. Haden came from. I am of the opinion that she was being silly because she liked him for Fanny’s sake (though perhaps she liked him herself, a little bit).
I do agree with you Mags, on both accounts. That’s where they got the idea but streched it too much.
There is another quote from her letters where I think they got the idea that she was jealous of Fanny because of Haden (Letter no. 128) because she almost desires her niece should be gone so Henry could recover faster.
Still, it seems I would accept more willingly the speculations of this film than those so off the mark ones from Becoming Jane.
Karenlee, I agree with you about the no aversion to wine. What others may have found unappropiate, I am looking forward to watch it (as soon as it becomes available, either the DVD or the strayed signal
) and judge if it is what I had imagined from her.
As you say, the original quote of the shaking hand was many years before when it seems to appear on the film, however, as you say, there are many references in her correspondence about drinking and there is one of the later years when she commnents something like one of the advantages of being now the chaperone is that then she was allowed to drink as much as she wanted (these are not precisely her words, I’m just paraphrasing the idea).
I figured the joke was Haden and Hayden.
I figured the joke was Haden and Hayden.
Do you mean Haydn?
Just an FYI to throw into the mix. If Jane did have Addison’s Disease of the Adrenal glands, there would likely be a very gradual onset of symptoms before an acute exacerbation, possibly due to stress, called an Addisonian Crisis or Acute Adrenal Insufficiency. Not sure if the symptoms would go on for 15 years before an exacerbation of symptoms.
I’m noticing a trend that the adaptations Janeites like are not liked by critics, who don’t get all the details that were right, while the adaptations that take the most liberties annoy those of us who know better, but end up delighting those who don’t. In Entertainment Weekly this week, Becoming Jane gets a B+ while The Jane Austen Book Club, based on Karen Joy Fowler’s well-detailed book, only gets a C+. This was the reverse appraisal of Richard Roeper when the films came out, and he seemed rather more well informed on Jane than I would have thought. Miss Austen Regrets seems to have been better received by lovers of Jane than by critics in general, perhaps because it was so attentive to details like the order of the novels, if not her hats.
Soes anyone know if Miss Austen Regrets is available online anywhere, as the new S&S very quickly was?
I am wondering the same think, Karenlee. The links are not necesary if they may cause troubles to Mags, but just a pointer would be enough. So far, I still searching in the usual sites where the adaptations were available when they first aired in UK, but nothing. I am astonished that people over there were more quick to upload them, than now people in US have been. Is it that nobody recorded in any digital format?
Cinthia/Karenlee – where do people normally post online? Cinthia mentions the ‘usual sites’ is there a way to located those sits, per say, google on certain words.
The latest Sense & Sensibility was up within – it seemed – days of the broadcast on some Asian site. Don’t have the link to it anymore though.
*checks in hopefully*
I guess no one has found anywhere on line where we can watch this yet…